On 07/18/2012 10:23 AM, Sanders Kaufman wrote:
"pyotr filipivich" wrote in messageMost losers have disdain for successful college graduates. Obama is
news:klod085d5sqmfvkrqc6j3hpjfiaqf48vqq@4ax.com...
It does seem hat the only way to be that stupid is to
have gone to college past the basic degree and into graduate school.
My sympathies are with you on that.
I've seen a lot about right-wing colleges - Regents, Glenn Beck U, Paul
Quinn.
They really do suck.
But hey - Kudos to Quinn for not losing their accreditation this year.
counting on the jealousy of you losers.
On 7/18/2012 12:57 PM, ?@qmail.not wrote:
On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 22:45:12 -0600, Wo Tan<wt@in.valid> wrote:
On 7/17/2012 9:54 PM, ?@qmail.not wrote:Unfortunately to those out of work, that is not true.
On Mon, 16 Jul 2012 17:53:34 -0700, azjohn<haboob@nothere.com> wrote: >>>>
Because his record sucks.
Yep, you fascists wanted to put the whole nation out of work to
bankrupt the nation of it's revenue.
Hyperbolic and counter-intuitive, no one on either side wants a whole
nation "out of work"?
Really, well please do explain for "them, or perhaps you are "them"...
You want them out of work and the US out of money.
Well that's just a stupid, silly lie. I want the Clinton years back when >everything was humming along.
I think you're cranky and need to take more naps.
Stupid remark from a stupid person.
Who pays you to regurgitate these ludicrous screeds?
Look, we can both agree you're stupid, no problem there at all.
So you dream up a number and therefore it must be true?
Obama saved the jobs in spite of
your efforts.
At roughly 247,000$ per job "saved", 247,000 taxpayer dollars that is... >>>
I never dream, I always cite:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/cost-obamas-stimulus-plan-312500-job-vote-create d-or-saved-and-guess-who-paying-it
For those eager to put some math to the rhetoric coming from the White
House over the president's jobs creation plan, and that should be
everyone, here is a quick and dirty estimate based on the numbers being >thrown around of a 2% GDP increase in year 1 and 1.9 million jobs
created or saved... most saved, as in those you can't really quantify.
Said otherwise, roughly a $300 billion increase in GDP yields 1.9
million jobs. So far so good. Now since the president is proposing to
pay for the program over 10 years, let's assume the $475 billion in
direct expenses is financed for 10 years at 2.5% which adds roughly $120 >billion to the total cost of the program. In other words, as the >calculations detailed and show below elaborate, the overall AJA plan
will cost $250,000 per job created (excluding the interest expense) and >$312,500 per union job, er job created (including interest). And that's
how much it costs for Obama to purchase one vote... created or saved. >Keynesian efficiency strikes like a Swiss watch yet again.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/obama-s-economists-stimulus-has-cost-27800 0-job_576014.html
Obama’s Economists: ‘Stimulus’ Has Cost $278,000 per Job
The stimulus is now causing the economy to shed jobs.
The report was written by the White House’s Council of Economic
Advisors, a group of three economists who were all handpicked by Obama,
and it chronicles the alleged success of the “stimulus” in adding or
saving jobs. The council reports that, using “mainstream estimates of >economic multipliers for the effects of fiscal stimulus” (which it
describes as a “natural way to estimate the effects of” the
legislation), the “stimulus” has added or saved just under 2.4 million
jobs — whether private or public — at a cost (to date) of $666 billion. >That’s a cost to taxpayers of $278,000 per job.
In other words, the government could simply have cut a $100,000 check to >everyone whose employment was allegedly made possible by the “stimulus,”
and taxpayers would have come out $427 billion ahead.
Now then, Harvard's Martin Feldstein estimated 200K$ per job, so I think
we can agree I was quite charitable by even undercutting the CEA's
official number.
Anyone might be any number of your radical conservacrap friends. That
You must be pissed beyond reason.
I think anyone who saw that number was.
hardly means every or any one.
Oh I think most Americans get pretty worked up when they realize what
the alleged "stimulus" cost us.
When you wanted jobs lost and he saved them, you call it failed. We
Better to be pissed
off than pissed on, right comrade?
Yes, Obama and his failed stimuli have pissed on us all.
understand.
He really never saved much of anything because:
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/obama-s-economists-stimulus-has-cost-27800 0-job_576014.html
Furthermore, the council reports that, as of two quarters ago, the >“stimulus” had added or saved just under 2.7 million jobs — or 288,000
more than it has now. In other words, over the past six months, the
economy would have added or saved more jobs without the “stimulus” than
it has with it. In comparison to how things would otherwise have been,
the “stimulus” has been working in reverse over the past six months,
causing the economy to shed jobs.
Really.
The US government is being held hostage to stop it's taxation
practices.
Oh really?
I don't see anyone stopping me from paying my taxes, ymmv.
No one did, yet.
Who told them to stop collecting taxes?
Oh, I see, "yet"?
So then you lied.
Granted.
You're quite insane aren't you?You're just full of stupid remarks aren't you?
I don't make immediately idiotic and refutable lies like you do.
For whom, the rich?
The president does not create jobs, nor is he responsible
for making them go away.
So Bush was not to blame? Not that it matters, decisions by the
Executive branch have impacts on jobs, and Obama's blunders have doused
what could have been a nice recovery.
For the 16.7% without work, obviously.
I suspect the "rich" are mostly continuing to pull in their spending and >thereby not creating as many jobs.
Because:
http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2010/08/05/us-economy-is-increasingly-tied-to-the- rich/
Well, perhaps everyone should these days. Consumer spending accounts for >roughly two-thirds of U.S. gross domestic product, or the value of all
goods and services produced in the nation. And spending by the rich now >accounts for the largest share of consumer outlays in at least 20 years.
According to new research from Moody’s Analytics, the top 5% of
Americans by income account for 37% of all consumer outlays. Outlays
include consumer spending, interest payments on installment debt and >transfer payments.
By contrast, the bottom 80% by income account for 39.5% of all consumer >outlays.
Bullshit.
US companies who pay the salaries are the
only people that are responsible for or the lack of jobs.
The "lack of jobs" is a result of the lack of "demand".
No, just fact.
When folks stop consuming, things stop being made, and jobs are lost.
The supply for the demand isn't coming from Americans but
is still there.
Well that's just crazy talk, isn't it?
So the "supply" for this "demand" you think exists is sitting where, in >whose warehouses?
And if there is a shortage of say durable goods why haven't prices shot
up to match?
See, you're really quite far out of your depth here.
What kind of drugs are you on, LSD?
Now don't you feel silly for believing US companies can purchase their
way back into prosperity?
Have you stopped beating your wife?
Try using English.
They make
the decisions to move operations out of the country and they can make
the decisions to bring them back.
Oh sure, and what would you Iphone cost made here?
Try explaining what a US made Iphone would cost, come on, do it.
Oh, never mind:
http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/why-iphones-arent-made-in-america/
Not long ago, Apple boasted that its products were made in America.
Today, few are. Almost all of the 70 million iPhones, 30 million iPads
and 59 million other products Apple sold last year were manufactured >overseas.
Why can’t that work come home? Mr. Obama asked.
Mr. Jobs’s reply was unambiguous. “Those jobs aren’t coming back,” he
said, according to another dinner guest.
The president’s question touched upon a central conviction at Apple. It >isn’t just that workers are cheaper abroad. Rather, Apple’s executives >believe the vast scale of overseas factories as well as the flexibility, >diligence and industrial skills of foreign workers have so outpaced
their American counterparts that “Made in the U.S.A.” is no longer a
viable option for most Apple products.
And why does cost matter?
Let's take the popular Ipad:
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/05/how-much-would-the-ipad-2- cost-if-it-were-made-in-the-us-about-1-140/238508/
How Much Would the iPad 2 Cost If It Were Made in the U.S.? About $1,140
America can't compete globally and shouldn't have to.
it's about competing globally, or maybe you're one of those Hyundai
driving liberal hypocrites...
What a fascinating bit of head in sand-ism.
To the first point:
http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/why-iphones-arent-made-in-america/
Another critical advantage for Apple was that China provided engineers
at a scale the United States could not match. Apple’s executives had >estimated that about 8,700 industrial engineers were needed to oversee
and guide the 200,000 assembly-line workers eventually involved in >manufacturing iPhones. The company’s analysts had forecast it would take
as long as nine months to find that many qualified engineers in the
United States.
In China, it took 15 days.
Companies like Apple “say the challenge in setting up U.S. plants is
finding a technical work force,” said Martin Schmidt, associate provost
at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. In particular, companies
say they need engineers with more than high school, but not necessarily
a bachelor’s degree. Americans at that skill level are hard to find, >executives contend. “They’re good jobs, but the country doesn’t have
enough to feed the demand,” Mr. Schmidt said.
To the latter - then we FAIL and invert, much as the Communist USSR did.
Sorry, with NAFTA, GATT, CAFTA,etc. and currency alliances like the EU, >we're not able to return to isolationism as a national policy, too bad, >quite a bit sad in fact...but still a fact.
Of course not. The greedy are the wealthy. The unemployed are the
Taxes have been cut though it's
obviously not enough to satisfy the greedy.
You mean the unemployed? Yes, those greedy workers, the heck with them... >>>
needy. You wouldn't understand that.
The "unemployed" are drugged into stasis by unending unemployment checks.
The wealthy have no need to be greedy as they already have theirs.
See how that works...
You know that.
So they put us out of work
thereby cutting down on the nation's revenue.
They did?
No, I do not.
If no one is working, no one is paying taxes.
But you just claimed (erroneously btw) that 90% of us ARE working, so
which is it? You can't have both sides of the highway at once you know.
You rich bastards don't.
Aw <snifffle> is that some green-eyed jealousy I hear from you?
You're breaking my heart.
Do they?
The corporations control demand?
No, they certainly do not.
They respond to demand.
Do yourself a favor - buy an econ 101 text book, spend quality time
reading it.
You can pull that bullshit on an idiot not here.
Seriously?
Lol.
And China is not the
enemy, Corporate America is.
Your illucidity is stunning - neither one are "the enemy", and for you
to hate those who employ Americans is sickening.
Which idiot did you have in mind? I still have you to try and wake up.
Heheh, you're crazy.
In fact China is in bad shape right now,
a victim of its successes as the US is.
China can deal with their own problems, stop torching straw men off.
Nope, I'm a realist.
I want our problems fixed, they can worry with their own.
50¢/hr was ok for awhile. Now they need 25¢/hr. When corp can find it
What will China do when
corporate leaves them hanging high and dry?
Why would "corporate" do that? It's still a global market, do try and
have a good think about how things work, won't you?
they'll leave.
There is more to life than manufacturing, in fact there is a very key
growth segment to this economy involving SERVICE (driven by aging
boomers), and you can't outsource health care jobs.
Can you make up that crap without your drugs?
The Corps are being
careful; for if they go too far, the economy might crash but with over >>>> 90% of the people still workin; doubt there is any chance of that.
But of course that many are not working, as real unemployment (U6) is
hovering near 16.7%
I think you are up way past your nap time:
http://portalseven.com/employment/unemployment_rate_u6.jsp
http://www.wnd.com/2012/02/real-unemployment-rate-22-5/
For instance, in Table A-15, titled “Alternative measures of labor >underutilization,” the BLS reports what is known as “U6 unemployment.”
U6 unemployment includes those marginally attached to the labor force
and the “under-employed,” those who have accepted part-time jobs when
they are really looking for full-time employment.
While the BLS was reporting seasonally adjusted unemployment in January
2012 at only 8.3 percent, it was also reporting U6 seasonally adjusted >unemployment in January 2012 was 15.1 percent.
The only measure BLS reports to the public as the official monthly >unemployment rate is the seasonally adjusted U3 number.
http://bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t15.htm
June
2012
15.1
Incentive is meaningless when there are no jobs.
In the meantime, they blame the President and liberal democrats for all >>>> our woes while unemployment drains the nation's bank account and our
government tries to compensate with extended benefits.
Great observation, with those out of work and on perennial unemployment
where is the incentive to FIND A JOB?
Oh but there are, there really are!
They just require a bit more gumption and training than this nation has
any more.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/12/02/on-job-hunt-manufacturing-jobs-readily-av ailable-with-no-skilled-workers-to/
Anyone who tells you the jobs just aren’t out there, has not spoken with
the employers at Excel Foundry and machine in Pekin, Illinois. That
company is trying to expand but is having difficulty.
Excel says the reason for this is because recruiters cannot fill the job >vacancies. Yes, you read that right, they can not fill the vacancies.
“We’re absolutely frustrated, we’re doing everything we can to attract >employees we desperately need right now,” says Doug Parsons with Excel.
The catch is that Excel, like many U.S. manufacturers, is looking to
hire skilled workers. That means tradesmen with training like welders,
pipe fitters and machinists. That is where the problem lies.
For most Americans while in their high school years, the pressure was on
to go to college and get a degree. Trade schools were looked at as a
back up plan for those who did not excel.
Larry Sarff with Morton Industries says, “One of the problems in finding >people is the perception that manufacturing is a dying art and that jobs
are not going to be there because they're being sent overseas.”
In fact, the department of labor says there are four million fewer
people working in skilled labor positions today than there were 20 years >ago.
So companies like Excel are turning to the high schools and trying to
change the perception of a career in the trades.
“Most people when they think about engineering think about dark dirty
grungy dead end type jobs. That's not what we're talking about. We're >talking about high tech jobs,” Says Parsons.
Big companies are putting on job fairs and conventions. They put teens
on busses and explain to them the potential of long term employment at a
pay rate up to 80 thousand dollars per year.
Right to some foreign country, yep.
Gone.
Not forever, all we need is more vo-tech education and training.
Remember, you can't outsource a plumber, welder, framer, mason, or >electrician...
One of the reasons you want to dry up the cheese and everything else
But there's plenty of time to watch TV and eat government cheese.
with it?
Stop being silly.
I would like to see our government quit dropping high carb food bombs on >native Americans though.
Does your brain know what your lips are saying?
Sooner or later
they will win and all of those items corporate America wants to get
rid of will be gone, SS, M&M.
Your hysteria is getting the better of you again, if indeed there is
such a thing.
Are you practicing that in the mirror?
Either you are playing stupid or just plain stupid.
The current government is making things
worse by trying to keep up with its obligations
Lol!
So really after all the hypocritical accusations it turns out it's YOU
that favors a massive credit default.
No, you got caught by your own emotion-driven rhetoric, oh well...
That happens to
people who speak without realizing what they are saying.
So take a breath, pace yourself.
Still making up numbers you know nothing about?
Lol, it is to laugh!
but sooner or later
they won't be able to, the deficits will be really out of sight.
Oh no kidding the tab on Obama-care alone will spike them so far his 5
trillion $$$ monument to economic unreality will look like chump change. >>>
Are you denying his 5 trillion$ in NEW deficits?
Need some cites?
Whatever it is, we need it.
No, we really do NOT need to default, sorry.
Nope, just someone who can see through the shit you people are
The
worst part of all this is there is nothing us little people can do
about it.
You're not one of the "little people", in fact you're a paid shill.
throwing around.
You can't even grasp very basic economics, it's pretty laughable what
you're keying here.
are you finished making stupid remarks, comrade?
You fascists win and the American people lose, Comrade. You
must be so proud of yourselves.
Your handlers are all Marxists, aren't they?
Good.
Are you finished being a"komrade", Marxist?
Make it so.
On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 22:32:53 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com>
wrote:
On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 23:54:37 -0400, ?@qmail.not wrote:Since you are lacking in english comprehension, look up the definition
Because his record sucks.
Yep, you fascists wanted to put the whole nation out of work to
bankrupt the nation of it's revenue. Obama saved the jobs in spite of >>>your efforts. You must be pissed beyond reason. Better to be pissed
off than pissed on, right comrade?
Sorry..you are in error. Badly in error. Or in denial. >>Socialist/Progressives/Liberals/Leftwingers are brothers to Fascists
of Liberal and while your at it, Fascists.
On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 15:09:06 -0400, ?@qmail.not wrote:
On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 22:32:53 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com> >>wrote:
On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 23:54:37 -0400, ?@qmail.not wrote:Since you are lacking in english comprehension, look up the definition
Because his record sucks.
Yep, you fascists wanted to put the whole nation out of work to >>>>bankrupt the nation of it's revenue. Obama saved the jobs in spite of >>>>your efforts. You must be pissed beyond reason. Better to be pissed >>>>off than pissed on, right comrade?
Sorry..you are in error. Badly in error. Or in denial. >>>Socialist/Progressives/Liberals/Leftwingers are brothers to Fascists
of Liberal and while your at it, Fascists.
Oh..I did. Long ago. Liberals and Fascists are in the same family as >Socialists.
Shrug..and you are in denial, sadly.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_Fascism
Crap, I stopped putting the Bachelor Degree* on Job apps about ten
- fifteen years ago. Wasn't relevant at all to the jobs I was after.
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