From: nospam.Rick.Smith@p1.f202.n340.z1.binkp.net

Greetings All!


So I have completed the switch to linux with my mystic bbs (from windows) and
I actually just put it online an hour ago. In watching MIS screen I am noticing that all my fidopoll events now end with a RES 127 when they used to end with a RES 0? As far as I can tell seems to be functioning ok, anyone run into this before? Is there anything different about events in linux version that I missed? I checked all my ini files and they are correct (I think)

Hope all of you are well



----
Regards,


Rick Smith (Nitro)

... No honey, I'm not BBSing again - I'm writing a letter to my mother.

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From: nospam.g00r00@f215.n129.z1.binkp.net

windows) and I actually just put it online an hour ago. In watching MIS screen I am noticing that all my fidopoll events now end with a RES 127 when they used to end with a RES 0? As far as I can tell seems to be

A 127 code in Linux is the shell saying that it cannot find whatever it is
that is being executed. Its hard to say more without knowing more about the event, but usually if you have something like:

"fidopoll" you'll need to change it to "./fidopoll" in Linux.

I was experimenting with having Mystic automatically add the ./ in Linux but
I can't remember why I didn't do it.

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From: nospam.Paul.Hayton@f100.n770.z3.binkp.net

On 19 Aug 2020 at 02:13p, Rick Smith pondered and said...

So I have completed the switch to linux with my mystic bbs (from
windows) and I actually just put it online an hour ago. In watching MIS screen I am noticing that all my fidopoll events now end with a RES 127 when they used to end with a RES 0? As far as I can tell seems to be functioning ok, anyone run into this before? Is there anything different about events in linux version that I missed? I checked all my ini files and they are correct (I think)

Hi there

It will likely mean the process you are trying to run is failing as it's not being called correctly.

Check you have something like this in your shell line

./fidopoll 21:1/100

Res 0 means success so you definitely want to check into this.

Best, Paul

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From: nospam.g00r00@f215.n129.z1.binkp.net

I was experimenting with having Mystic automatically add the ./ in Li but I can't remember why I didn't do it.

1. Have mis know where it's run from and just make everything without an explicit ./ or /mystic path assume the base mystic directory.
2. Expanded instructions in the wiki (or an inline help?) about what should be happening in those event shell fields.

That's already how it works, but ./ is required to specify current directory (even if you're in it).

The issue here is that he has an invalid command in the shell command field. Mystic is properly reporting "this is an invalid command". In this case its not misundertanding the shell field, its a misunderstanding of how Linux works.

When I get around to moving the event documentation out of release notes and onto the Wiki I will note the differences between Windows and Linux to help
out with common mistakes.

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From: nospam.Andre.Robitaille@f70.n154.z1.binkp.net

On 19 Aug 2020, g00r00 said the following...

I was experimenting with having Mystic automatically add the ./ in Linux but I can't remember why I didn't do it.

Given what I've seen from FB groups and echos of people making the switch, I don't think you should change it like that. Some people don't understand
what's supposed to be in there, but many don't understand unix paths and
the path variable. I'd say some combination of the following:

1. Have mis know where it's run from and just make everything without an explicit ./ or /mystic path assume the base mystic directory.

2. Expanded instructions in the wiki (or an inline help?) about what should
be happening in those event shell fields.


- Andre

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From: nospam.Andre.Robitaille@f70.n154.z1.binkp.net

On 20 Aug 2020, g00r00 said the following...

That's already how it works, but ./ is required to specify current directory (even if you're in it).

That's true, but I mean have Mystic figure that out for the user, so they
don't have to know that or figure it out.

Maybe the logic to error check what someone puts into the field becomes too complex though. I would say that documentation should take priority over a technical fix like I was suggesting earlier.


- Andre

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From: nospam.Nicholas.Boel@f10.n154.z1.binkp.net

Hello g00r00,

On Wed Aug 19 2020 21:31:10, g00r00 wrote to Rick Smith:

"fidopoll" you'll need to change it to "./fidopoll" in Linux.

I was experimenting with having Mystic automatically add the ./ in
Linux but I can't remember why I didn't do it.

Because newcomers to linux shouldn't have it *that* easy. Everyone should be able to learn the basics at the very least. Once you learn the basics, running a Mystic server is easy as all get out. Then you can spend time learning the more difficult things. ;)

Regards,
Nick

... "Take my advice, I don't use it anyway."

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From: nospam.Andre.Robitaille@f70.n154.z1.binkp.net

On 21 Aug 2020, Nicholas Boel said the following...

Because newcomers to linux shouldn't have it *that* easy.

Things need to be either intuitive or documented.

Linux has an abundance of documentation and books, so while it's not easy,
it can be understood.

The shell field of the event editor is neither intuitive nor documented. If anything, it's a right of passage.


- Andre

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From: nospam.Nicholas.Boel@f10.n154.z1.binkp.net

Hello Andre,

On Fri Aug 21 2020 19:42:50, Andre Robitaille wrote to Nicholas Boel:

Linux has an abundance of documentation and books, so while it's not
easy, it can be understood.

The shell field of the event editor is neither intuitive nor
documented. If anything, it's a right of passage.

Does it need to be?

If you were to google "how to execute a binary in Linux" I think your answer would be the first to come up tho. I don't understand why it's Mystic's responsibility to show people that?

Even in Windows, one way to make sure of proper execution is to use the full path to the executable. This also works in Linux and then _doesn't_ require "./" to execute.

Regards,
Nick

... "Take my advice, I don't use it anyway."

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From: nospam.g00r00@f215.n129.z1.binkp.net

Because newcomers to linux shouldn't have it *that* easy.

Things need to be either intuitive or documented.

The shell field of the event editor is neither intuitive nor documented. If anything, it's a right of passage.

I agree the event stuff needs to be gathered from whatsnews and put onto the Wiki. I'll look into doing that the next time I am on there making edits. But I am curious why you're saying the shell field is not intuitive or documented and what you have in mind to improve it?

When you set the shell field in the editor it tells you right in the editor that the field is the command line that will be executed when the event runs. What more should be said about that? If a person doesn't know what a shell is or a command line is, then they're already in over their heads trying to run a BBS (especially on Linux).

Mystic's event system already has a full screen dedicated to events, their execution times and types, and also tracks potential issues (which is how we knew the event was failing with error 127). A quick Google of "error code 127 linux" gets an explaination in about 30 seconds of effort. Having a view into your events status so you can easily spot an issue and then being able to determine what that error is in about 30 seconds of effort isn't exactly a bad system! Certainly better than most!

The ./ thing specifically is tricky because its not Mystic, its Linux. By trying to explain it I'd be getting into trying to teach people how Linux works. There are times when adding a ./ would break things too. Its a deep rabbit hole to jump into in terms of documenting, and maybe better suited for linking to some how-to Linux guides or something.

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From: nospam.Andre.Robitaille@f70.n154.z1.binkp.net

On 22 Aug 2020, Nicholas Boel said the following...

Does it need to be?

Of course it does. Always.

Software should always be as intuitive and well-documented as possible. There are zero exceptions to this. Often you can reduce the amound of documentation if the UI is sufficiently intuitive.

I certanily miss the old days where few people had computers, and the ones
who did knew how to use them because they were tinkerers and hackers and whatever. But relying on search engines and other offloading documentation
onto proactive endusers? I'm surprised that this is even considered to
possibly be okay.

- Andre`

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From: nospam.Nicholas.Boel@f10.n154.z1.binkp.net

Hello g00r00,

On Sat Aug 22 2020 00:38:36, g00r00 wrote to Andre Robitaille:

The ./ thing specifically is tricky because its not Mystic, its Linux.
By trying to explain it I'd be getting into trying to teach people how Linux works. There are times when adding a ./ would break things too.
Its a deep rabbit hole to jump into in terms of documenting, and maybe better suited for linking to some how-to Linux guides or something.

Best practice would be to use the complete path to the executable, just like in Windows.

Regards,
Nick

... "Take my advice, I don't use it anyway."

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From: nospam.Rick.Smith@p1.f202.n340.z1.binkp.net

Greetings g00r00!

Answering a msg of <22 Aug 20>, from you to Andre Robitaille, about Re: Switch to linux:

I got everything to work on the pI4 except python a couple python scripts result in mismatch apt errors, so for now just stopped using the script (anipause) I ultimately after 24 hours had to switch back to my windows setup. I realized while everything was polling and running mutil with result 0 the mail was nowhere to be found. I could get netmail back and fourth mostly but no echo mail posted on the pi mystic would go anywhere. all my paths are correct, I even after developing blurry eyes had another sysop ssh in and he was unable to find what it could be.. Not even sure why I am telling you this as I have no idea where to look Ive read everything I can read triple checked every INI file. Possibly I will watch mystic guys pi mystic setup videos and see if there is something I am missing. For now its back on my nuc running windows so no worries.

PS is there a way to resize mystic windows in linux? or rather just have mystic match size of terminal windows?

Hope you are well


----
Regards,


Rick Smith (Nitro)

... BBSing very long distance - from Atascadero, California

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From: nospam.Todd.Yatzook@f799.n142.z1.binkp.net

On 22 Aug 2020, Rick Smith said the following...

Greetings g00r00!

Answering a msg of <22 Aug 20>, from you to Andre Robitaille, about Re: Switch to linux:

This is the guy I was telling you about in the other message base, and the issue he's having. =)

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From: nospam.Nicholas.Boel@f10.n154.z1.binkp.net

Hello Andre,

On Sat Aug 22 2020 09:54:56, Andre Robitaille wrote to Nicholas Boel:

Does it need to be?

Of course it does. Always.

Software should always be as intuitive and well-documented as
possible. There are zero exceptions to this. Often you can reduce the amound of documentation if the UI is sufficiently intuitive.

I certanily miss the old days where few people had computers, and the
ones who did knew how to use them because they were tinkerers and
hackers and whatever. But relying on search engines and other
offloading documentation onto proactive endusers? I'm surprised that
this is even considered to possibly be okay.

While I totally get what you're saying, and in many cases you're definitely right. But, *Basic* Linux 101 should probably be known before trying to run servers on it. Don't you think?

Maybe James ASSUMEd that was the case, and originally thought the user of said operating system would know how to execute a shell command. Other than that, it doesn't hurt anything if it was added for those that don't know, I guess. ;)

Regards,
Nick

... "Take my advice, I don't use it anyway."

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